Shires orchestral tenor trombones were the first instruments that Steve produced and were what cemented his reputation as one of the leading brass instrument designers. 8 watching. T 85: . Elliott Bradley @Eroboticdude. Alternatively, a large small bore (King 3B, Bach 16M) is a great horn if you mostly do jazz but want to be able to play legit stuff with one horn. 525 … It's always a good tip to start on your larger instrument first and do small later in the day. I feel obligated to put this in here, because I hear this question a lot. I used to wonder if those numbers and letters were important to the mouthpiece size. Send Message to Eroboticdude. If you find yourself in the upper register a lot, you can also consider a smaller rim size. 485-inch bore, compatible with small-shank mouthpiece; T 0: . The range on a small bore trombone starts on the low E, going up as high as the chops allows. Large bore trombones, or symphonic trombones, usually have a .547′′ bore and a bell size of 8.5′′ (215mm). Some people will disagree, but the articulations are different, the way you use the air column can be different, (also, using a smaller horn and mouthpiece automatically means you will need to treat the horn differently. Making a conscious effort to separate these styles and techniques for different horns may prevent you from slipping up in a classical ensemble and playing something stylistically inappropriate. This isn’t actually obvious if you’ve never bought a mouthpiece before (meaning your instrument just came with one and you’ve stuck with it until now). Take the mouthpiece you have and play. It is a .525 bore with a specific bell stem section. But it is generally not recommended that you choose a width based on this. So, the best thing is to try it out and see if it works for you. If you’re trying to guess based this, you’re going to be in for a surprise more often than not. £18.75. To me: resistance. It’s an option. Do you want to be the best large bore/orchestral style player out there, or do you want to be a great all around player that can handle any genre and doubling that might be called for? These are usually secondary considerations. Guide to small bore vs. large bore trombone Posted on April 10, 2012 by Anders Larson A tenor trombone is always tuned in Bb, but unlike the trumpet, it is a non transposing instrument (probably because trombone players like to call a bone for a bone instead of a Bb for a C). 10 Unconventional Tips for Music Auditions, 5 Steps to Playing in Tune (the hard way). It is pretty medium sized all-around. The short answer is yes. The smaller this is, the more resistance you’ll have. Beginners grow in technique and strength very quickly, and so a few months on a too-small mouthpiece might mean you’ll be buying a new one sooner than you expected. Bell diameters also vary between 6 1/2″ and 10 1/2″ with some manufactures giving you the option of a larger bell diameter for greater dynamics. Back bore is more complicated, because it consists of both size and shape. Slightly bigger than the SY1.5 and a bit smaller than the standard SY tuning slide. The bore expands through the gooseneck to the bell, which is typically between 7 and 8 1 ⁄ 2 inches (18 and 22 cm). They feel more “wet,” which allows you to use less pressure and adjust your mouth position to get the tone colors you want more easily. Hi everyone. So, you just started or are just coming back to low brass playing. The quick answer to the question is that it depends. Jazz players tend to want brighter sounds, more flexibility, and the ability to solo. The best is the one that produces the sound you want. For my euphonium, I play on a Schilke 51C. Dual. Small Bore Model 4.5. So, you must put the orientation dot up. The main trombone mouthpiece size differences are the rim width, cup depth, throat, and back bore. I once got a mouthpiece that fit the instrument and felt comfortable, but it totally messed up the intonation in two of my partials. Basically I'm wondering if playing a bit each night on my small bore horn is going to effect my large bore playing? I highly recommend using width for comfort considerations and nothing more. King Legend 4B has a large .547 inch bore … There are many factors which can affect your sound and style as a trombone player, and which instrument you use is an important one! It may be a little strange at first, but you'll get used to it. 500-inch bore, compatible with small-shank mouthpiece; T 8: . Unfortunately, the numbers go in reverse, so the bigger the number, the smaller the rim size, which can be confusing. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, Press J to jump to the feed. You’ll run out of air faster and need stronger lip strength to play for long periods of time. Why this should be so is at first not apparent. But also get used to going back and forth. I have even heard TUBA players play a full sound while playing softly. But again, don’t be short-sighted. It is the nature of a smaller tube to give a kind of resistance that is needed to get that feeling and sound. There are many times I’ve had to sit for long periods of time, and I wish my mouthpiece wasn’t cold (I’m looking at you Mendelssohn’s Fifth Symphony with no trombone in the 2nd and 3rd movements). But also get used to going back and forth. You don’t have a baseline for what feels comfortable, what range you want, how your tone should sound, and so on. It's always a good tip to start on your larger instrument first and do small later in the day. There are some generic rules, but they don’t apply to every brand. -If the Diameter of the bell is 8.5" or larger it is most likely large. Cookies help us deliver our Services. Large throat is recommended for more advanced players. The SY1.0 is somewhere in between the two others. The main thing I’d think about is to not get too wrapped up in “beginner” mouthpieces that are too small. The general rule is that the number refers to the rim and the letter refers to the cup depth. I’ve never played on one, but I know several people that do and love it. This means that once it warms up, it won’t get cold as quickly. Once you get to bass trombones, it makes it much harder to play but for small bores it's a smaller difference. This week we review the Kanstul 1570 large bore tenor trombone. Trombone bores generally come in three sizes: small bore, medium bore, and large bore. 2 objects. 508-inch bore, compatible with small-shank mouthpiece; M: . They have less feedback in large ensembles. Oh, this debate has been going on forever. With a large bore, this trombone offers consistent tones making the performance great. In my opinion, it really depends on what the player in question is wanting to achieve, or perhaps is struggling with. You will find that most professional players do play a variety of trombones depending on the setting. I do also play some bass and euphonium and even a little tuba and have done so in various settings from large bands and orchestras to broadway musicals. Go for a .547 horn. Larger bore Trombones having bells with faster rates of taper, yield darker symphonic tone qualities. £1,462.76. Playing large bore before small bore will help prevent your sound from getting thin. Before you can even think about numbers and sizes of mouthpieces, you have to know what type of instrument you have. One can find oneself glancing through endless variations of shapes, sizes, materials, and types only to think: What are the differences in trombone mouthpiece sizes? If you’re in the market for a new mouthpiece, I’d highly recommend finding some way to try it out before actually purchasing (or make sure the online source has a guaranteed, unconditional return policy). Completing the Lawler line of trombones is the Model 4. The way I see things, the starting point of the graph (vertically) is determined by the bore size: large bore = low initial resistance, small bore = high(er) initial resistance. Wedge mouthpieces aren’t perfect circles: they’re ovals. Due to the larger tubing, the large bore tromboneis more mellow, and is the first choice among classical trombone players. Having said that, there are things that you gain as well, it really depends on what your goals are. If you have a standard tenor trombone, baritone, or student-intermediate euphonium, you probably have a small shank. I’ve seen a lot of claims, but ultimately, they are subjective, like many of the other parts of this article. Best of Luck. Large bore trombone. If you think about a mouthpiece, it is perfectly symmetrical. A small throat means you can play with less air, play longer phrases on the same breath, and you’ll fatigue slower. Custom Series Large Bore F-Attachment Trombones. The long answer is that there is always a trade off when broadening your practicing to include other trombones or instruments. For a one-size fits all, do-everything horn, it's hard to beat a .525 bore horn like a Bach 36, King 3B+, etc. If you play euphonium, you might not be able to borrow a trombone mouthpiece or even a mouthpiece from another euphonium player in your band. Yes it'll affect you in the short term but it's so helpful in the long run getting used to playing different horns each day. The shank size matters. The … I couldn’t even find alternate fingerings to make it bearable. You can find yourself on the market for a mouthpiece dozens of times. I’ve never played on one, but I can see the appeal. A larger bore requires more breath and produces a rich, flamboyant timbre and a … I won’t even make a recommendation. S.E. The mouthpiece Christan first developed for large bore tenor in 2001 is now available in small bore. Price: $175 Specs: Custom Series Small Bore Trombones. It will be observed that it is almost invariably the Big Bore who attacks the Small Bore. You’ll quickly grow into it. But there is no doubt that if my only goal were to win an orchestral audition, I should be spending all of my time on the big horn. For some frame of reference, I make most of my income playing the large bore trombone, but I am also a good doubler on alto. You can put it in, rotated any old way, and it won’t affect anything. The YEP321 has a small-shank receiver, but it has a bore of.571" For comparison, a Bach 42 trombone has a large-shank receiver, but a bore of.547", significantly smaller than the euphonium. I've been spending most of my time for some time now playing my large bore trombone (haven't played my small jazz horn in awhile) and I have the desire to start using both depending on what is called for by the gig. Ask yourself if you want a brighter or darker tone. But things get weirder. On Sale! Many of us develop an expensive habit of trying out different mouthpieces to get an edge on tone quality or clarity of sound or to extend our range. They have a lot of testimonials and famous brass players that endorse them, so I have no reason to be skeptical of their claims that these improvements do what they say. Both beginners and professionals will enjoy this mouthpiece. Among other things, this is supposed to help with people who wear braces. This is usually made to balance the other aspects of the mouthpiece, and should not really be a major consideration, except in one circumstance: When testing mouthpieces, you must check tuning in all registers. Now, think about the type of music you play. … Even the exact same letters and numbers can have tiny variations within the same brand. People have stated that horns can’t backup, big bores can’t play softly…… I can play soft while using a .472 bore trumpet. I’ve put this here, because this article is a part of my “Frequently Asked Questions.” I’m not sure why people have this need for knowing the “best” of everything. Very open and with a rich sound. That said, that's exactly right... the dual bore tends to make the horn sound larger than it is. It's a dual bore. There is a size between these two, sometimes called a “European shank” or “medium shank” for euphonium. Tenor trombones typically have a bore of 0.450 inches (11.4 mm) (small bore) to 0.547 inches (13.9 mm) (large or orchestral bore) after the leadpipe and through the slide. The throat refers to how tightly the hole at the back of the cup pinches. I just thought it was worth a mention, since it’s something you might consider in choosing a mouthpiece. People make all sorts of claims about them. The extreme low range consists of the pedal tones, available one octave below the root on each position. This can even mean borrowing one from someone. The smaller the bore, the less breath is required, resulting in an instrument that is easier to play and which boasts a subtle, mellow timbre. The rim has a contour that goes along with the natural shape of your teeth. It’s what I started on, and it worked all through tenth grade, getting me into All County every year. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites. The item is suitable for small and large tenor trombones and, since it is made by Bach, you will get great quality for the price tag of this product. A reasonably priced mouthpiece from a trusted manufacturer probably won’t have this problem in modern day (it was the mouthpiece that came with a very old baritone). If you fatigue in the high range, then a better long-term fix is to develop more strength. This bell has a very warm full tone great for small group jazz and big band solo. Wise Grip - now also available for Small Bore Trombones! Great match for someone who mainly play large bore trombones? The Griego 4.5 uses the same rim and cup as the large bore model making it the perfect mouthpiece for trombonists playing on larger small bore equipment. This determines if the mouthpiece will even fit in the leadpipe of your instrument. I later found out that the cheaply made back bore was the problem. Mostly legit stuff? If you have a standard tenor trombone, baritone, or student-intermediate euphonium, you probably have a small shank. For instrument differences, see this article. Should you consider a gold-plated mouthpiece? Rim width determines flexibility, range, and comfort; cup depth determines tone quality; throat determines volume, breath control, and tone control. There's a large difference in mouthpiece size, Greg Black 5GS for large bore and Bach 7c for small bore so I figure if anything this might have the most drastic effect. What I might suggest doing is only using your small bore for jazz type stuff. ... Denis Wick DW5880-5BL Silver-Plated Large Bore Trombone Mouthpiece. If you have a professional tenor trombone or euphonium, you probably have a large shank. Z-5 Bronze .025 Bronze has color much like copper bells but with more ringing quality. Typical current bore sizes are .450 small, .460 medium, .468 large and .472 XL. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. If you want a brighter tone, you’ll want a shallower cup. -If the student is playing on the same trombone which they started with, it will most likely be small bore as most beginners don't start on a large bore trombone-Generally Large Bore Trombones have an F-Attachment as picture below (left). Shires designs its line of small-bore tenor trombones for players who love the flexibility and clarity of a small-bore trombone and also want a rich sound that will project well at all dynamics. This trombone is worth the cost. If you are relatively comfortable playing full rehearsals without major fatigue, you’ll probably want to stay with a similar rim width. S.E. This means you’ll probably want a smaller cup than if you play in orchestra. The shape and taper can greatly affect pitch, so be warned. In this video, I compare the large and the medium bore trombone using 5 comparison tests. But things get weirder. I personally think that playing on other trombones or instruments enhances my broader musical base, therefore making me a better musician. Other than that, everyone does their own thing. The lettering is a bit stranger. Smaller bore Trombones, having bells with slower rates of taper produce a brighter jazz sound. Not knowing where you are at with your playing level now makes it hard to say if it's a good time to start broadening your options or if you should really master one trombone first. If you are in the beginner-intermediate range, and you think the throat of a new mouthpiece is slightly too large, then you should stick with it. 0 Followers. The small bore tromboneis typically used by jazz players, and has a bright sound. 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