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Gay marriage around the world

#41 User is offline   Roderick 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 08:31 AM

View Postscotto, on 12 February 2013 - 07:12 AM, said:

Really this depends on what you define as "the homosexual lifestyle". Gay men and women don't all live on Oxford Street, Sydney and go to the Mardi Gras, for example. Lots of them think all that is a waste of time.

Definition: being homosexual.
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#42 User is offline   Bam 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 09:09 AM

View Posticey, on 11 February 2013 - 10:21 AM, said:

Rather a specious argument coming from you Bam. Nobody has defined the issue as the pairing of "abnormal" people.

Bullshit. :rolleyes:

View PostRoderick, on 07 February 2013 - 02:38 PM, said:

Within the context of the society in which I move, homosexuality is considered abnormal, not conforming to the norm;

This was given as a reason against allowing gay marriage. Otherwise why make this claim at all in a thread that discusses the topic?
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#43 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 11:17 AM

View PostRoderick, on 12 February 2013 - 08:31 AM, said:

Definition: being homosexual.

That's not really a usable definition, is it?
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#44 User is offline   Roderick 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 11:20 AM

View Postscotto, on 12 February 2013 - 11:17 AM, said:

That's not really a usable definition, is it?

Well it is for someone who isn't born that way but wants to be one so does so.
Don't tell me that you think that there are not people who choose to be homosexual?
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#45 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 11:49 AM

View PostRoderick, on 12 February 2013 - 11:20 AM, said:

Well it is for someone who isn't born that way but wants to be one so does so.
Don't tell me that you think that there are not people who choose to be homosexual?

You'd have to point out some examples for me to think it was anything but exceptionally rare. What proportion of people do you think do this?
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#46 User is offline   Roderick 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 12:44 PM

View Postscotto, on 12 February 2013 - 11:49 AM, said:

You'd have to point out some examples for me to think it was anything but exceptionally rare. What proportion of people do you think do this?

Haven't got the foggiest, but I don't doubt that it happens.
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#47 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 12:50 PM

View PostRoderick, on 12 February 2013 - 12:44 PM, said:

Haven't got the foggiest, but I don't doubt that it happens.

Well if it's an infintesimally small number, as I suspect, it's not really relevant, is it?
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#48 User is offline   Roderick 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:10 PM

View Postscotto, on 12 February 2013 - 12:50 PM, said:

Well if it's an infintesimally small number, as I suspect, it's not really relevant, is it?

but you don't know the numbers, particularly among females.
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#49 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:12 PM

View PostRoderick, on 12 February 2013 - 02:10 PM, said:

but you don't know the numbers, particularly among females.

You've said that you don't know the numbers - and there is no evidence to suggest it is a significant proportion.

Why "particularly among females?"

So - as far as we know it's an insignificant figure.
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#50 User is offline   icey 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 02:41 PM

Quote

icey, on 11 February 2013 - 10:21 AM, said:
Rather a specious argument coming from you Bam. Nobody has defined the issue as the pairing of "abnormal" people.


View PostBam, on 12 February 2013 - 09:09 AM, said:

Bullshit. :rolleyes:

This was given as a reason against allowing gay marriage. Otherwise why make this claim at all in a thread that discusses the topic?

Roderick, on 07 February 2013 - 02:38 PM with emphasis added said:

Within the context of the society in which I move, homosexuality is considered abnormal, not conforming to the norm;
This was given as a reason against allowing gay marriage. Otherwise why make this claim at all in a thread that discusses the topic?


I'm confused as to who "gave a reason", but remain unaware of an argument that "abnormal" people should not marry each other.

I whole heartedly embrace the new turn of phrase, that being "equal marriage".
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#51 User is offline   Roderick 

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Posted 12 February 2013 - 05:03 PM

View Postscotto, on 12 February 2013 - 02:12 PM, said:

You've said that you don't know the numbers - and there is no evidence to suggest it is a significant proportion.

Why "particularly among females?"

So - as far as we know it's an insignificant figure.

Because I've been told that many girls don't consider that a cuddle and a bit of sexual play between girls has any great significance; and in my days as a hippy, girl and girl events were discussed even though the females concerned were in heterosexual relationships.
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#52 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:17 AM

View PostRoderick, on 12 February 2013 - 05:03 PM, said:

Because I've been told that many girls don't consider that a cuddle and a bit of sexual play between girls has any great significance; and in my days as a hippy, girl and girl events were discussed even though the females concerned were in heterosexual relationships.

So.... nothing to think about there. Really this part of the discussion is about labels, pure and simple. What people call themselves is totally up to them. Lots of men who regard themselves as straight have had sexual contact with men, sometimes quite often.

This is about whether the people concerned, whatever they call themselves, can marry each other.
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#53 User is offline   Roderick 

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 07:39 AM

View Postscotto, on 13 February 2013 - 07:17 AM, said:

So.... nothing to think about there. Really this part of the discussion is about labels, pure and simple. What people call themselves is totally up to them. Lots of men who regard themselves as straight have had sexual contact with men, sometimes quite often.

This is about whether the people concerned, whatever they call themselves, can marry each other.

Well, at the moment there are laws, which if people want them changed they are quite free to ask that they be so changed.
An excellent way to do this would be to ask the Government to put the question to the people at the next election and then all could abide by the decision of the people; very democratic.
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#54 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 08:57 AM

View PostRoderick, on 13 February 2013 - 07:39 AM, said:

Well, at the moment there are laws, which if people want them changed they are quite free to ask that they be so changed.
An excellent way to do this would be to ask the Government to put the question to the people at the next election and then all could abide by the decision of the people; very democratic.

Yes, lots of people are asking that this law be changed. No need for a referendum or plebescite.
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#55 User is offline   Roderick 

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 10:13 AM

View Postscotto, on 13 February 2013 - 08:57 AM, said:

Yes, lots of people are asking that this law be changed. No need for a referendum or plebescite.

Yes there is, because this is an issue on which we ought to know the will of the people.

So let the people decide.
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#56 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 10:20 AM

View PostRoderick, on 13 February 2013 - 10:13 AM, said:

Yes there is, because this is an issue on which we ought to know the will of the people.

So let the people decide.

We already know the will of the majority of the people. It's just up to the elected reps to do the right thing. {What a silly thing to wait for.}
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#57 User is offline   Roderick 

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 10:45 AM

View Postscotto, on 13 February 2013 - 10:20 AM, said:

We already know the will of the majority of the people. It's just up to the elected reps to do the right thing. {What a silly thing to wait for.}

We don't know the will of the majority of the people at all, some people think that they do but that's only based on opinion polls and we all know just how unreliable they can be.

People's true opinions can only be found out via the secrecy of the ballot box.

Those that think that popular/majority opinion favours their desire for a change in legislation should welcome the definitive decision of a people's vote.

What have they got to fear?
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#58 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 11:27 AM

No, we've been through this time and again. The sampling used by opinion polls makes them quite reliable.

Nothing to fear at all.
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#59 User is offline   Roderick 

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 12:05 PM

View Postscotto, on 13 February 2013 - 11:27 AM, said:

No, we've been through this time and again. The sampling used by opinion polls makes them quite reliable.

Nothing to fear at all.

Nothing to fear from opinion polls but everything to fear from a referendum.
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#60 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 12:59 PM

View PostRoderick, on 13 February 2013 - 12:05 PM, said:

Nothing to fear from opinion polls but everything to fear from a referendum.

Again, a discussion that has been had here at least a couple of times before. Opinion is known; we can safely act now.
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