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Legalising same-sex marriage in Australia?

#41 User is offline   icey 

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 09:17 AM

View Postscotto, on 22 July 2011 - 08:47 AM, said:

Finally he gets it...... lmao... I know, I know..


Don't be so sure Master Scotto!

Senexx, the exact target of your "exactly the point Icey" comment was ambiguous to say the least.
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#42 User is offline   Senexx 

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 10:08 AM

Not in the least, read my remarks, read your remarks, read my remarks. I only weighed in with one notion that you addressed.
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#43 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 10:58 AM

View Posticey, on 22 July 2011 - 09:17 AM, said:

Senexx, the exact target of your "exactly the point Icey" comment was ambiguous to say the least.

Not really, Eyesee.
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#44 User is offline   icey 

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 02:55 PM

View PostSenexx, on 22 July 2011 - 10:08 AM, said:

Not in the least, read my remarks, read your remarks, read my remarks. I only weighed in with one notion that you addressed.


Riddle me this?

I think it is in fact all about ideology on both sides Senexx. One centuries old ideology firmly established within western society, the other a johnny-come-lately spurred by extremists not representaive of their tribe.
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#45 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 02:59 PM

View Posticey, on 22 July 2011 - 02:55 PM, said:

I think it is in fact all about ideology on both sides Senexx. One centuries old ideology firmly established within western society, the other a johnny-come-lately spurred by extremists not representaive of their tribe.

You know, you're right. This idea that marriage and marriage-like relationships are strictly limited to male-female patrnerings is a very recent, narrow and unrepresentative view seen against the history of western civilisation.
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#46 User is offline   icey 

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Posted 22 July 2011 - 08:42 PM

View Postscotto, on 22 July 2011 - 02:59 PM, said:

You know, you're right. This idea that marriage and marriage-like relationships are strictly limited to male-female patrnerings is a very recent, narrow and unrepresentative view seen against the history of western civilisation.


Without reference to biology but keeping to your own reference to mainstream Western civilisation, please do go on Master scotto.
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#47 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 23 July 2011 - 07:24 AM

View Posticey, on 22 July 2011 - 08:42 PM, said:

Without reference to biology but keeping to your own reference to mainstream Western civilisation, please do go on Master scotto.

The reference was to history, Eyesee.
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#48 User is offline   Bam 

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Posted 24 July 2011 - 05:44 PM

View Posticey, on 21 July 2011 - 03:43 PM, said:

Hmmm. Not wanting to break any rules or anything. I read an implied or tacit approval in your OP on vices in that you seemed to distance yourself from the "fundies who love beating the homosexual drum".

So make your correction of my position even clearer; you in fact dissaprove of the said vices, but retain your "non-fundy" hat? Feel free to correct my uncertain spelling and also keystrokes that drop off and double up my dodgey keyboard..

You misread my original post, especially since you selectively quoted only a portion of the relevant paragraph in your first response to it and then proceeded to misinterpret it. In the part that you omitted, I stated this: "It is interesting how these fundies love beating the homosexual drum, yet do not seem to have read their scripture from cover to cover". IMO, this was a fairly harmless comment. But by omitting this part, you then slanted the rest of the paragraph differently to my intent.

It is not unreasonable to suppose that some parts of the Bible are not read as diligently as others. The Simpsons had an episode that illustrated this, when Homer listened to the Bible on tape but fast forwarded over the part that described who begat whom. (It was the episode where Homer ate fugu and thought he had been poisoned.) Some parts of the Bible are not fit for reading by children and as a consequence the translation of the most problematic parts of scripture is often bowdlerised to mask its true meaning.

I have explained quite clearly in two separate posts that the behaviours I listed was just a list. (Make that three posts now.) What part of "It was just a list" do you have difficulty understanding?
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#49 User is offline   Senexx 

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Posted 24 July 2011 - 05:45 PM

Icey, I don't deal much in ideologies but practicalities.

Innocent until found guilty = new. Most cultures including us until recently Guilty until found innocent.
Ditto monogamy.

I work with what we have today, not with what we had yesteryear. This is not something I hold a status quo ante view on.

I am ambivalent to the concept. Those on either side of this discussion whinge too much about it and get too much air time for something that is ultimately trivial. It's a third order concept.

Food, Shelter, absence of social isolation, cost of living, jobs are many things that are way more important than the concept of same-sex marriage. Compromise on it get it out of the way so we can deal with the real stuff.

It is little more than a protest movement from either side.

However the topic is about legalising same sex marriage in Australia. I've said my bit. It is as fair as compromise as there can be unless anyone has other suggestions that involve a compromise.

And that is all I have to say on the topic.
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#50 User is offline   icey 

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Posted 24 July 2011 - 06:05 PM

View PostBam, on 24 July 2011 - 05:44 PM, said:

It is not unreasonable to suppose that some parts of the Bible are not read as diligently as others. The Simpsons had an episode that illustrated this, when Homer listened to the Bible on tape but fast forwarded over the part that described who begat whom.


Bam, without claiming any particular high ground myself, I must say your theological mentor achieved high ratings in certain circles. Still, anyone who can write such long poems must be at least literate. :)



Senexx, if you come from a position without ideology, then it is obviously difficult to argue against your stated position.
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#51 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 25 July 2011 - 01:10 PM

View Posticey, on 24 July 2011 - 06:05 PM, said:

Senexx, if you come from a position without ideology, then it is obviously difficult to argue against your stated position.

What's your ideology, Isee?
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#52 User is offline   GeorgeParsons 

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Posted 25 July 2011 - 04:35 PM

Marriage is a social custom.It was created by people and can be changed by people. It is not like a law of physics.Customs are constantly in flux.
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#53 User is offline   icey 

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Posted 25 July 2011 - 04:51 PM

View Postscotto, on 25 July 2011 - 01:10 PM, said:

What's your ideology, Isee?


I'm a Christian scotto, the gold standard of ideologies imho :)

Or politically, you can see my imperfect picture on the political compass thread.
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#54 User is offline   icey 

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Posted 25 July 2011 - 04:56 PM

View PostGeorgeParsons, on 25 July 2011 - 04:35 PM, said:

Marriage is a social custom.It was created by people and can be changed by people. It is not like a law of physics.Customs are constantly in flux.


That surely depends on the society GP though of course there must be at least some social element. Irrespective though of whether you consider it merely to be little more than a social custom (perhaps akin to ettiquette), this does not mean that it need be definitively changed.

Of course this being Australia, despite the whines of atheists, greens et al, we have a Judaeo-Christian background. Is this particular tradition inalienable? I guess not, however I'll defend it as much as others might eagerly attack it.

And let our Islamic population put in their two bobs worths as well?
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#55 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 08:35 AM

View Posticey, on 25 July 2011 - 04:51 PM, said:

I'm a Christian scotto, the gold standard of ideologies imho :)

that's nice... what kind?
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#56 User is offline   icey 

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 09:47 AM

View Postscotto, on 26 July 2011 - 08:35 AM, said:

that's nice... what kind?


The type that's not into the denominational labels you may be looking for.
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#57 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 10:31 AM

View Posticey, on 26 July 2011 - 09:47 AM, said:

The type that's not into the denominational labels you may be looking for.

not really an explanation, though, is it?
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#58 User is offline   icey 

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Posted 26 July 2011 - 05:32 PM

View Postscotto, on 26 July 2011 - 10:31 AM, said:

not really an explanation, though, is it?


Not sure if you were looking forward to my own publication of some sort of theological manifesto, but what's your ideology?
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#59 User is offline   scotto 

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Posted 27 July 2011 - 08:30 AM

View Posticey, on 26 July 2011 - 05:32 PM, said:

Not sure if you were looking forward to my own publication of some sort of theological manifesto, but what's your ideology?

More on you first - it seems to explain how sensitive you are on some issues, for example, to comments made by others about the christian right in the current NSW government. I don't think you need to publish more theological material than you've already put on these pages.

My ideology.... I would describe it as generally humanist, but not particularly left or right-wing; internationalist in a sense. Not religious explicitly; evidence or research based where possible.
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#60 User is offline   Senexx 

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Posted 28 July 2011 - 01:51 PM

I love how I can bring economics into this, we went off the gold standard in 1934 Icey, and we went off the de facto gold standard (bretton woods) in the 70s - so the gold standard is outdated, outmoded and the primary cause of recessions. If we relate that back to the concept of marriage instead of using an analogy, recession in this case would be mental depression.

Therefore...well nevermind, what comes next is self-evident.
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